Kelly (00:02.815)
Welcome to another episode of the Big Home Ed Conversations. My name is Kelly and I'm here as usual with my lovely friend Ashley and we are going to be talking to you today about how we follow our kids lead. This is a lovely light episode, there's no school bashing in this one I promise. We're be talking about our experience of really starting to understand home education and actually how
Ashley Vanerio (00:23.019)
Okay.
Kelly (00:31.835)
like it was such a massive shift in terms of de -schooling, absolutely, but recognising that actually it's actually not that easy to just follow your kids lead, to just trust them, to follow that, to show you what they would want to learn and where they want to go. But once you actually start to recognise the amazing strength that they have in being able to do that, it's actually really quite good fun, isn't it, Ashley? I think it's something which you can really start to see them come alive when you let them follow their own interests.
Ashley Vanerio (01:02.882)
Yeah, absolutely. And I think it's really lovely to be able to afford them the time to stick with something. sometimes you get going and you need more than the 30 minutes you might have initially allotted because they really get into it. So it's fun to be able to let them continue with the creativity.
Kelly (01:24.083)
Yeah, it is really fun when you can see them coming and going on for the tangent, sometimes for weeks or months at a time. It's so much fun. But it leads me quite nicely into my little news that I've got going at the minute. So it's my turn to share our fun for the week. I am relatively impulsively when I got a puppy last week, not a literal impulse purchase. I've wanted one for about three years, that miniature dachshund that I cannot say the life of me, dachshund.
Ashley Vanerio (01:36.833)
Hmm.
Kelly (01:53.451)
It's a German word and I really cannot seem to get my tongue around it. Anyway, is gorgeous, absolutely gorgeous. And me and actually have both been talking about trying to get one at the same time and I have no patience. So she has to just put up the fact that I'm giving her an E so she can enjoy it for a bit. It's been really lovely because that's actually kind of something which I've been working on with the kids is we've been learning about dogs for the past few weeks. So.
We've been watching documentaries on Disney, for example, where they've got about different dogs breeds and why they're the different shapes they are and what they were bred for. And we were learning about how you actually take care of a puppy and going to like, and just wandering around the aisles and just looking at all the puppy stuff and talking about what they are and why they're there and why puppies need them and all that sort of thing. And it's been such a fun project to be working on.
but I've been literally watching them today, kind of doing their little training with him and my son was hilarious. He doesn't like, he had a dog chase him that long ago, like a puppy Labrador that was big. And he was playing and he was just like, my son was chasing him and then the tables just turned and the dog started chasing him back. And it freaked him out. really upset him and he got really scared.
It took, and sadly took me a moment to realise that he genuinely was actually scared, like he was used to just playing. So it took me a second to obviously just like get in between them and stop it. But it led to some really great conversations around like body language and recognising when a dog is playing versus when it's angry and actually dangerous. And obviously going to run away from a dog that is chasing you. Stop making yourself taste worthy.
It was really, really fun to watch like, he surround our deck out the back of the house with this dog just chasing after him. See, it's so small. It's squinting like it's like a great pet or something. But he was really having fun today. Like he was just really enjoying being chased and it's just so lovely watching them really come alive. Like they're really lit up by the experience. I'm jealous as hanging of like the attention the dog is getting as well, which is really quite funny.
Ashley Vanerio (04:02.763)
it is.
Kelly (04:13.331)
I wasn't quite expecting the level of jazz experience this week. It's amazing. I feel like having another baby in the house because I'm just like, can I have a baby boy? I'm like, my attention has gone straight to him. they're like, excuse me. We have babies. Yeah, he's paying attention to us. Yeah, I think what's been really lovely is, obviously with the inspiration of knowing that we were going to get a puppy, it's just created this really fun
Ashley Vanerio (04:16.759)
yeah. yeah.
Ashley Vanerio (04:28.012)
We are your children.
Kelly (04:42.661)
environment where they've obviously shown interest in something and were really excited to have it and really wanted to make sure we could get one and so they were willing to do absolutely anything to actually have one. And since getting there they've wanted to obviously stop him from biting their fingers and like not try and grab their clothes and not try and their toys and they're having to learn really fast and especially my youngest I've been really amazed by how quickly she is picking up the
She can't leave her favorite doll on the floor right now. And if she does make a puzzle on the floor, she needs to put it away quick before the puppy pees on it. This has not happened yet, but it was close. And you can say, well, think just maybe you've to mindful of using the table or putting things up high when you're done. Like, don't leave them out because they're going to get ruined and it's made by living with them much tidier. But it's just really fun watching them picking up new skills and awarenesses of
how to take care of an animal and how to be conscious of needs. It's really fun when you watch them kind of get into these, we call it project learnings, I I tend to consider it our topic. So this is currently what we are using as our, it's kind of like our trampoline, I guess, to like, just jump off of and to keep that kind of just keeps kind of giving us another little boost into something else. And so like, we'll keep doing loads of different avenues into learning about it for a while until we all get bored and then we'll just move on.
It doesn't have any fixed ending, it just fizzles out when the interest dies. And sometimes we can go on for months with a topic that is working that they're enjoying. And you were saying before we got on that yours were just always into animals and that that always makes you really happy.
Ashley Vanerio (06:30.112)
Yeah, it's definitely one of those things where, just like you were saying, we'll follow a topic for really long time and then it fizzles out because something else has trumped it, a new interest. And it's so funny because I keep trying to weave my desired topic or interest into it. Like I want to do something about something that's happening in current events or...
thinking right now about the upcoming presidential election in the States. And I have a lot of ideas for that. And I want to sort of base a lot of our reading and just kind of overall conversations around different things like the geography of the United States, where all the states are located and how the voting works.
and all of this stuff. And I know it is going to be a bit of a challenge because they just only want to learn through the vein of animals, particularly horses. We're very interested also in snakes and insects. And so even for things like math, we're doing like multiplication around, well, if you had seven horses and they all ate four pounds of hay.
how many pounds of hay would you need? I think things like that. So it's one of those things where, you know, we, I've said this before, we do have some kind of more formal, I would call it curriculum that we do follow when it comes to math and language arts. But I, at every moment that I possibly can, will swap something or try to create an opportunity for us to weave it into what they're interested in because
they really then do get excited about doing things. And particularly if we're able to paint or color or use clay to kind of help bring in any of those sort of like hands -on opportunities, that definitely does buy me some more time on say like reading a book that's maybe not about our topic. be like, here's some clay, create a horse while I read you about like...
Ashley Vanerio (08:52.362)
I know in the future this is going to be about the upcoming election and kind of what that means and why it's important. So yeah, I'm constantly looking for those opportunities to kind of pop in something they're interested about, but still somehow bring it back to me and what I'm trying to direct our crews, if you will. But we're doing it together.
Kelly (08:56.98)
See you.
Kelly (09:18.547)
Yeah, I think it's interesting, it? How you can you use their current interests themselves to just occupy them and keep them busy whilst you obviously try and bring other topics in, but also to help people actually develop an understanding of those topics. like Mike then was going, well, I'm wondering if like, you could take it back to like the founding of the states and where did they get their horses from and what kind of horses did they find then? And then like
Ashley Vanerio (09:45.89)
100%. 100%.
Kelly (09:47.367)
Why is it that people loved horses? like, know, I'm going to love to do this anyway, like just like ask a question or two questions of a question and all of sudden we've got a massive tangent. I this is like every conversation I ever end up in. But that just made me go, it sounds so interesting because I wonder how many presidents used to ride horses and like, did like, why did they ride horses? Why is it considered to be so noble? Like, what's that all about? like, it's just like, maybe the topics do blend always.
Ashley Vanerio (09:53.847)
Yes.
Ashley Vanerio (10:12.577)
Mm
Kelly (10:17.533)
We were talking once about dogs or something and you said about kind of different dogs in different regions of the entire world and like actually you can talk about geography and also like the climates and the kind of terrain and the kind of animals they might have encountered and the uses they would have had for them and the kinds of farming they would have done and you know what I mean like all of these things are connected to dogs. So like if they're interested in something
Ashley Vanerio (10:17.964)
us.
Ashley Vanerio (10:39.746)
Exactly. Yeah.
Ashley Vanerio (10:44.663)
Yes.
Kelly (10:46.951)
It's so much fun, like connecting the dots to something else that you maybe want to inspire them to think about. Because I think one of the things which I always think is a bit of a myth about unschooling is this concept that you genuinely just leave your case to just do whatever they want and you never kind of give them any kind of direction. And yes, I get that the idea of it isn't to constantly force specific curriculum or whatever onto them, like to make them do a certain thing. However,
Ashley Vanerio (11:03.488)
Right.
Kelly (11:17.191)
It is our job to inspire them. And we don't know what we don't know. We don't see what we don't see. I mean, there's bazillions of things that I have only seen because of the that become a person also. We've happened to read a book or I've happened to talk to a person and these thoughts then just get planted in my brain and go, it's interesting. And I want to go learn about that. I don't want to know to go even looking for it unless they know it exists. And I think that's one of the things which I think people do think that unschooling is actually
like really hands off and you're never actually helping your kids. It's kind of the complete opposite. As you sort of see that you follow some curriculum and some structure, but I think we're very similar in the sense that we both want to inspire them to think about the things to just be aware of other stuff that's going on in the world, especially current events, because especially like with obviously the loss of like abortion rights and stuff like that is super important, especially having three girls like to
Ashley Vanerio (12:13.015)
Mm -hmm.
Kelly (12:15.241)
to really empower them to understand politics and to know what to do, to how to actually fight back against this stuff. It's really boring when you put some effort into doing that and you see an outcome actually come your way if you actually see things change and that's amazing to watch. So yeah, I think it's really important, isn't it, really?
Ashley Vanerio (12:15.594)
Yeah, absolutely.
Ashley Vanerio (12:40.234)
Yeah, and I think it's something that is actually, I can understand if you're listening to this and you're new to home ed, you might be like, okay, that is a lot of work. But it actually really does happen quite naturally and you can start pretty slow. for example, like I was talking to the girls about how we're gonna learn about like the map of the United States. And the first thing my oldest said to me was, can we make a map about where all the animals are? And I said,
Yeah, we can definitely do that. We can definitely take a map of the United States and we can do what their state animal is or state bird or state flower. And that would be really fun and something that they're a lot more interested in than just like, this is Alabama and this is North Carolina. So that is a really easy thing to tailor. But if your kid is into cars, well, you can see, where are cars made in the United States? What state are they made in?
What state sells the most cars? What state sells the most Corvettes or Jeeps or whatever? And you could even blend that into machinery. So where are more diggers or forklifts or whatever? So you can really easily, especially with the internet now, right? I imagine 15, 20 years ago, it's made it a lot harder to do, really going through that encyclopedia. But now this information is so easily available.
Kelly (14:09.118)
you.
Ashley Vanerio (14:09.462)
You're also teaching them how to search for things on the internet. So you can do that with them, right? How do we do that? Now we're typing, now we're spelling, now we're finding where the letters are on a keyboard. So all of these things can be really easily done and spill into a lot of different themes and topics and subjects, which is something that, again, just sort of happens naturally as you look for it.
Kelly (14:21.769)
Mm -hmm.
Kelly (14:26.697)
Mm
Kelly (14:38.813)
Yeah, one of my biggest hacks actually for this is if you use something like Chaggpt. If you're sat there thinking, we've done nothing today, I literally don't even know, like what have they even learned? Like, please, we haven't done anything formal, I haven't sat down and done anything focused, we've been so busy, we've done this and this and this this. So like, I'll give you a rundown of my day, this is what Chaggpt is amazing for, is you kind of plug in.
So for example, so we went and visited the neighbors with Poppy in hand, just cause of letting him get a bit of fresh air. He's not allowed to go proper walks yet. And we went and collected a stud finder from a neighbor because we needed to install these like aerial silk things for like as a swing slash climey whatever thing for the kids to do downstairs. I'm on a mission to add more sensory play into my house so they can get their wiggles out. So we've gone to a neighbor with...
Ashley Vanerio (15:28.938)
Love that. Yeah.
Kelly (15:32.445)
socialized, we chatted to a neighbor, we've gotten to know somebody new, we showed off the new puppy, they told them all about him, we got the stud finder, he showed them how it worked, we took it home. We've used the stud finder to find the studs in the roof and the ceiling, so the room, so that we could drill the holes. They watched their dad do the installation of it. We had to experiment for ages in terms of getting the height of it right because it kept stretching so far they were sitting on the ground, so we had to figure out how high it needed to go for it to work and for them to still be able to reach it.
Like, so you can go through all these things and it's just one activity and you can see when you actually start to break it down. If you said to Jett, Jett GPT, we went and got a stud finder from a neighbor and we did this and you're really genuinely sat there going, this is like, don't even know what we've done today. Like, incredible. It's an amount of information in that. Like what's the stud finder doing? How can it detect electric and metal and what, like how is it doing that? And like all these different questions that came from it.
Ashley Vanerio (16:05.324)
Yeah.
Kelly (16:31.505)
and watching him use a drill, watching him screw the stuff in, like adjusting the height. Like these are all things that allow them to build practical, relevant, important information about how the world works. Physics, science, measurement. Like there's so much to that. And we don't always see it in the, like when you think like, yes, okay, you sit your kid down, you get them to fill out a whole page worth of sums and you get some evidence at the end of it.
that they have actively done some maths and they have understood or not the task at hand and you can put them in a folder and it feels really accomplished. It feels like, okay, good, we've definitely done some addition. Yeah, it feels really good. And I get that that feels good because it's satisfying to our schoolie brain, the one that's desperately trying to quantify their education and to know what they're achieving, where they're at, what level they are. Like are they...
Ashley Vanerio (17:11.35)
Yeah. Yeah.
Kelly (17:28.313)
same as other kids who might be in school the same age? Are they going to be great one day? Are they ahead? Are they behind? All that nonsense. These questions come into my head and again, ahead and behind isn't something I'm subscribed to, obviously, because it's just such an arbitrary line and I don't really get it. But the point is that it's really good fun when you look at these things. Do you think, okay, fair enough, they haven't written it all down and they probably will forget half of what we talked about today in a heartbeat.
Ashley Vanerio (17:38.7)
Yeah.
Kelly (17:58.387)
But actually a tiny grain of information, a few tiny grains hopefully, will have come from that. And then another day we'll do another thing. And then another day we'll do another thing. And these things will slowly but surely form into a full and comprehensive understanding of the world around them. will spark ideas. It will build curiosity. mean, people like Albert Einstein and Isaac Newton and all these incredible scientists and inventors and like people who had like
Ashley Vanerio (18:26.21)
Yeah.
Kelly (18:27.421)
puzzled ideas and came up with incredible concepts that we like go, wow, wow, this is so smart, how did they get there? They got there because they were puzzled on something themselves. They were self motivated and have had various inspirations that have just sparked a thought and then they fought. I think that's all we're really there to do is to actually give our children as many opportunities to spark a thought.
And I would say like back in the early days, so this is something that's always made me smile. People kind of go, you'd walk around something with someone like Birdworld and you'd see parents ignoring their kids questions. They'd be like, mom, mom, what's that? Like, why is it that in its cage? Or like, what's it doing? Like, why is it doing that? And I'd be like, just let's go and put the flamingos. And I'd be like...
There was a moment when there was this kid literally cage after cage after cage kind of walking around the same bit as us and the parents literally did that every time. was like, I don't know kid, like just, just whatever. They're like, can you read this to me? Can you read me what it says? And they're like, no, like, on, like just carry on. I get it. We're bad days. I'm not judging. I found myself just being like, my God. And I literally stood and I read the sign out loud to my son in earshot so loudly enough for this kid to hear it. And then they were like,
That's really interesting. And they started asking me questions and I happened to answer them. was like, you know what, it's one of the biggest things about home ed and it does take a bit of effort. But when they ask a question, you answer it. It's as simple as that. In the moment, as they're having the thought, you think you'll answer it if you know the answer or you can, it's interesting. And you go and it up and you figure it out. You help them look it up, whatever you need to do.
Ashley Vanerio (20:00.076)
Yeah.
Kelly (20:13.639)
as much as humanly possible. Again, we can't always do it. We might be literally driving a car, but we should do our best. I think this is one of the things that I think is just fun because every time their brain is asking a question, it's currently puzzling something and it wants to know. And so if you can keep sparking that curiosity by feeding it, then it only leads to more questions. It only leads to progress.
And I think that's amazing. I just love watching it. It's so much fun.
Ashley Vanerio (20:46.274)
And this is one of the things where I don't know about you, but my questions like this come always at bedtime. And I am not diving into a 25 minute explanation of how we breathe at 8 .45. But what I will do is put it, have a note on my phone that is just like our questions.
and we will come back to it the next day. And this is good for like, if you happen to be somewhere or you're a little bit busy at the moment and you can't answer the question or like sometimes you're out and this is one of the ones like maybe I don't know the answer and so we do have to go home and look it up but I'm not looking it up in the middle of Morrisons. So that's one of the things where I'll put it on my note and we will go back and do it together whether we need to be in front of the computer or whatever the case may be.
So, but I agree, there's even a woman who creates these notebooks that you can get on Amazon. They're so fantastic, various different subjects. And one of them is a notebook for this. The maker is called School Nest. And you can find her on Instagram under School Nest. I think her name is Megan. And we have a ton of their notebooks, but I have yet to get this one. And I'm trying to hold off because I feel like I don't need all the things.
But this is definitely one of the ones where it seems fun and I can see the value in kind of filling it out altogether. And then having this like memory book of all the questions that like these big questions that your kids asked. the other night, my youngest was in bed at 8 .45, should have been asleep already. And she's like, how do we breathe? And I was like, honey.
That is not something we're getting into right now. Save the questions for the morning. yeah, but definitely. Yeah. Yeah.
Kelly (22:45.033)
Good night.
I'm going to and do my tactics, I've got to get a man over there.
Ashley Vanerio (22:51.102)
You know, and that's the thing. So I don't want to squash the question, but I am also not feeding into that. So it's okay. I'm putting it in my phone and we will answer that question in the morning.
Kelly (22:54.579)
Mm.
Kelly (23:02.419)
So when some questions have got like, you need some pictures? Do you need some diagrams? Or you need to show them a video? Or like, it's not always as simple as simply answering it. And I think, yeah, it's just fun, isn't it, when you get to have these conversations with them. like, I've always had the policy of trying to be as honest as I can in an age -appropriate way for every question they ask me. And I remember having like,
Ashley Vanerio (23:08.746)
Absolutely. Yeah.
Kelly (23:30.301)
an in -depth conversation with my son in hospital, he had to have surgery on it this year. And he's nearly eight now, so it's seven and half at the time. And he wanted to understand what was going to happen when he went on to the theatre. And I thought, you know, it's so amazing to have a child who is sure enough of themselves and wants to understand the world around them and is just curious and wants to get it. And yeah, okay, they aren't so, it's a little scary.
But also, knowledge helps to squash fear. He kind of asking the questions and getting an honest answer in a really calm, like, you're totally safe, everything's going to be wonderful, you've got loads of people who will be taking care of you, kind of way, actually helped him to process and understand what was going to happen. And actually, he has come away from it. He's hurt me in the day. And you start to be careful because otherwise you end up back in hospital.
Ashley Vanerio (24:05.185)
Yes.
Kelly (24:30.867)
moving to secondary on something else and he goes, it's okay, it's kind of exciting. And that's just like, I love that you have been through something which for most is reasonably traumatic. And you've actually come away from it with a, that's kind of exciting. I kind of liked all the attention kind of way. Now, I think it's lovely when, I don't know, it's just random stuff, it? Like experiencing life in an unhurried, curious way means that we actually get to
process from fear, we get to ask our questions, we get to think and be present in our thoughts and our day and actually be able to to deal with things as they happen as they come up. And I think going off a bit of a tangent now really, aren't we? But this kind of concept of following their lead, I think if we are listening to what they've got to say, and we're hearing their questions, but even if we're not bringing questions, then I guess it's not shifting slightly onto just observation.
So just noticing, I guess, what are they doing? Like, what do they seem to like playing with? What do they spend hours doing? Like, what are they interested in? What do they watch on TV when they go watch the telly? Like, there's a bunch of different things that sometimes I know I'm definitely guilty of this. Like my son watches YouTube for like the Minecraft YouTubers and stuff because he loves learning new tricks.
Ashley Vanerio (25:36.182)
Yeah.
Ashley Vanerio (25:51.948)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Kelly (25:53.987)
I cannot stand those videos. They are so loud and so irritating to listen to. They're clearly obviously aimed at children, like they just draw them in. I don't tolerate them. But he learns some incredible things from them. And then he's like whizzing around in mind -muff making this like a security house and I can't keep up and then he keeps blowing me up with TNT because I can't get into it now because he's made it so sophisticated that I can't figure out how to get in there.
Ashley Vanerio (26:02.539)
Yes.
Ashley Vanerio (26:10.262)
Yeah.
Ashley Vanerio (26:20.876)
haha
Kelly (26:22.855)
And so as much as, like, I try and like I play Minecraft with him, he gives me a YouTube monologue whilst we watch it anyway, because clearly that's what he witnessed people do when they're playing Minecraft is give you a constant monologue of what they're doing. mean, why can't you get that, which is great. But in doing so, as frustrating as that is, he's telling me tips and tricks and sharing his wisdom with me and his fascination with me.
Ashley Vanerio (26:37.462)
Yeah. Yes, right.
Ashley Vanerio (26:50.562)
Yeah.
Kelly (26:51.731)
and his plaschen and like, my goodness, the things he has learned about geology and redstone is essentially like electric circuits. And so like levers and buttons and like false floors and like all these amazing things that he's creating. I'm just like, you are so clever and you are taking in so much information. And if I follow his lead and we play in it and we do other random things in it and we...
Ashley Vanerio (27:14.038)
Yeah.
Kelly (27:18.227)
build roller coasters and we build really cool castles and we do all kinds of interesting stuff. It's symmetry and there is duneology, there's the understanding of rocks and siren, how things work together. There's all kinds of science to it. But also it's just, it's teamwork, it's communication, it's social skills, it's planning, it's just a lot of stuff. Like, it's so clever. And I think if you just witness what they're doing,
watch them, listen to them, really like I know we're very busy people and I get that I'm guilty of this all the time we get lost in all the stuff that we're dealing with in our own heads and we're trying to focus on and deal with but if just give like 10 minutes here and there to just watch them and see what they're doing and it helps to guide you as to what else to do like what else can you do with them like how could I use what they already love to help them do the things I really feel like it's important for us to
Ashley Vanerio (27:59.414)
Yeah.
Ashley Vanerio (28:06.198)
Yeah.
Kelly (28:16.339)
have covered off or and it's yeah following their lead in that way is really special and it shows them that you care it shows them that you actually are aware of what they're doing
Ashley Vanerio (28:28.618)
Yeah. Yeah. And I think one of the things that I heard a while back that really stuck with me when we think about, you know, our kids being like, you you're saying your oldest is really into Minecraft. And, you know, I have a daughter that will read every book about horses and dogs and then plays with them and then draws them and colors them and paints them and create, mean, just it is absolutely an obsession right now. And what's so cool about that, though, is when I heard that
Children that don't have that kind of interest in one particular thing in the way that it becomes like a very strong interest, they could spend a lot of time focusing on it, allowing them to go down that path and really develop that interest. It happens a lot with kids with like dinosaurs, right? You find the kids that, I just think that's one of the big ones that span a lot of different children. A lot of kids love dinosaurs or trucks.
And so allowing them to really develop that interest and to become absorbed in it is actually super important in their development because it allows them to focus and concentrate better on projects or work or things that they're doing for their job later in life. And children that didn't have that ability, like their parents were like, stop reading about dinosaurs and do this or whatever that might look like in a particular family.
or when you overload them with activities and they never have the time to really dive into something or spend an hour reading in their room or playing with Lego or whatever that particular interest is for them, they later in life can have difficulty spending an hour doing a project for their job. And so I think that not only are their interests very important just for who they are and kind of honoring that
in your children, but it also actually does impact their ability to perform later in life, depending on whatever job they might be doing. So I think that's just really interesting. It kind of gives you the freedom or like the permission to say, okay, we are going to spend some time on that. If this is what you want, you want five more dinosaur books at the library, you get five more dinosaur books at the library. Like we are just slowly making our way through all the snake and horse books at our libraries. And then they want to check them out again.
Ashley Vanerio (30:56.33)
great, let's check them out again. So I think it just lets you say, we don't have to read all the other books too. Like you can just do this.
Kelly (30:57.171)
Yeah.
Kelly (31:05.208)
And I think we maybe don't realise as well, I I think in our society we can get quite judgmental even about people who have these special interests, like we will mock people for example who are like, I don't know, train watchers or are like obsessed with kind of going and doing loads of bird watching all the time, it's just like we tend to refer to them in a derogatory way and...
So that actually feel quite scary. was thinking as I was listening to you then I was thinking it's interesting how it can actually make us worry. It's like, no, but if they're only going to focus on this, then how am I ever going to help them to have a broad education? Or maybe it makes you think that they're going to be considered to be a bit weird or a bit eccentric or whatever. obviously weird is a word that I'm typically reclaiming. Like weird is good. Like we should be different. Like we're not supposed to be the same as each other. And actually...
Ashley Vanerio (31:54.658)
Yeah.
Ashley Vanerio (31:59.671)
Yeah.
Kelly (31:59.879)
I think more of us than we realised would have well had these special interests if we'd been given the time. And we had these like, fascinations and specialisms. And actually those fascinations might have led us to careers or opportunities and hobbies that actually would have made us feel so fulfilled as human beings. I know that since I've started home educating, I have just developed the most insane amount of hobbies.
Some of them are short -lipped, some of them have gone on for a while. Things like actually listening to the birds. We got an app and we recommended the Merlin Bird ID app. We went up to the beach in Dorset and this lovely lady, as we were just checking in and paying the parking, my son commented to her out the window about how many lovely birds were singing, so there a bird feeder hanging nearby. And she goes, I know, it's wonderful, isn't it? She goes, I put those there. She goes, I'm stood here all day and I love seeing them.
Ashley Vanerio (32:36.29)
Mm -hmm.
Yeah.
Kelly (32:57.623)
massively into birds and she goes so in the quiet moments when nobody's here I get to just admire them and look at what they are and she pointed out what a few of them were and she she told us about this app and she goes it's free download it then you can listen and just press record on it and it listens for you and it tells you what you're hearing and I can now pick out a ribbon and a magpie and a blue tit and a sparrow and I know what they all sound like now I can actually listen to birds and go that is
Ashley Vanerio (33:14.582)
Yeah.
Kelly (33:24.463)
Even to the point where we on the fire camping on a lovely home -air trip together and we actually heard a nightingale and it was just like, where are we? What are you doing that? That's so amazing! I never would have even known what it was! I wouldn't have known that that was cruel, that that was exciting! And I think that I have realised that having these special interests...
Ashley Vanerio (33:39.797)
Meow.
Ashley Vanerio (33:45.804)
Yeah.
Kelly (33:51.589)
really make you feel good, they make you feel really excited and happy. I think we're allowed to have these moments and we're allowed to just really get engrossed in them. And it's, as you say, it's not that they literally will never do anything else ever. But it is that they will use those skills to build all the skills that we're worried about. They will help them to read. Like my son did not want to read Biff and Chip books. He did want to read dinosaur books. He wanted to read those dinosaur names.
Ashley Vanerio (33:54.882)
Really? Yeah.
Ashley Vanerio (34:18.572)
Same.
Kelly (34:21.117)
I was listening to it the day, he can read me, but he was going through this dinosaur book and actually working out the dinosaur names and saying them. And I was looking very shortly and I was like, my goodness, like, it's really good for like decoding the words and figuring out how they might go together. It's a real tongue -twister half the time. And I just absolutely blown away by it. And I think it's, it can feel really scary when
Ashley Vanerio (34:34.274)
Great. Good phonics.
Ashley Vanerio (34:43.285)
Yeah.
Kelly (34:50.259)
They're not interested in something that you think is really important and you want them to focus on that. And yes, you can find ways of blending their interests into it. But also it's kind of having some trust that, as you said earlier, they will learn to type, they will learn to search, they will learn to read, they will learn to like, because they want to understand more about this topic. So they are motivated to learn to read because they want to read the books on it or you know what mean? Like there's
Ashley Vanerio (34:54.018)
Yeah.
Kelly (35:18.035)
things that will inspire them to pick up the skills that you are worrying about because it actually feels really relevant and very important to them to get that information in their heads. Like my son did start to read because he was getting mad at me because he wanted to read this book in the car. So he actually started properly having a go. It's the first time I heard him read a whole sentence was because I was in the car and he wanted to know what it said.
Ashley Vanerio (35:29.068)
Yeah.
Ashley Vanerio (35:35.648)
and you can't read while you're driving.
Kelly (35:47.677)
And so he did it, he figured it out and I was just like doing a little job because he felt motivated to do it himself. So yeah, think it can be really tricky and I get that. Obviously we're talking from the perspective of obviously having kids who are who are somewhat intrinsically motivated and do have their special interests. And I guess if you're sat there with your kids and it seems like they don't have any, then it doesn't necessarily have to be
Ashley Vanerio (35:57.686)
Yeah.
Kelly (36:15.057)
specific topic or an animal or a thing, it can just be that they love building Lego or that they love playing a certain game or that they really love running and climbing in trees. Like, it doesn't matter what it is, if they enjoy doing it, even if it's only partly, like you notice that they sometimes really enjoy doing this or they sometimes really enjoy doing that. Like it doesn't have to be anything specific. Just kind of notice whatever they're into.
And A, try and let them do that as often as you can. But also see what you can do with it. See how else you can utilise that to help them meet their goals and what they're trying to work towards and just ask them, care about what they want to do. Like, would they like to go and handle a snake? Would they like to go and look at a hotel shop? Would they like to, you know what mean? Like, would you like to do these things? Because I can help organise them for you. Like, should we make them happen? And that makes them feel so special and so seen.
and yeah it's just amazing it's so much fun doing that with them and it helps to inspire you too it really has me anyway
Ashley Vanerio (37:22.976)
Yeah, no, absolutely. think one of the really exciting things about home educating your kids is that you kind of get to reclaim your education as well and maybe spend some time on things that you didn't when you were in school or that you don't remember learning about because you just learned it to pass the test and it wasn't anything that was important to you at the time. So I think that's really fun and definitely kind of a underlying benefit.
to home education is you just get to do it yourself too, along with them.
Kelly (37:57.247)
Yeah, you do. And I think I definitely felt coming out of school like I was running. I was so done with like being forced to learn anything, I guess, and run away from education for a while. And I definitely feel like having having my kids has really helped me and obviously getting into home education especially has definitely helped me to realise that learning is supposed to be fun and it is fun and I enjoy it.
And actually there's a lot more still to learn and there's always something new to sink my teeth into. And that's just been so wonderful. I'm so grateful for it really. But I hope that, yeah, it's just the best, isn't it? But I hope that you're listening to this and thinking about kind of actually what you'd love to reclaim and maybe if there's any hobbies or any interests of yours that you're maybe not focusing on right now. So please do think about.
Ashley Vanerio (38:35.266)
Yeah, me too.
Ashley Vanerio (38:39.873)
Yeah.
Kelly (38:52.777)
whether or not there's actually anything that you would love to be doing more of. Anyway, I've just kind of given you some insight into kind of how easy it can be truly to follow your kid's lead and to challenge trust, as is like the phrasing of trust the process. The process isn't always like perfect and it doesn't always go crystal clear and easy along the way. So don't get me wrong, like there are challenges to this, but ultimately the more you lean into...
letting them be interested in what they're interested in and build the skills that matter to them, the more you will see them build relevant, interesting hobbies, knowledge, wisdom and skills and eventually careers because they will have stuff that they know an awful lot about and that they can actually utilize for some purpose down the line. So trust them that they would get somewhere but...
Ashley Vanerio (39:30.71)
Yeah.
Kelly (39:46.109)
don't leave it all up to them. You're allowed to help and you're allowed to inspire and encourage and to support them along. You're definitely still there to facilitate and to help them to get new ideas and to build on what they're trying to do. But yeah, I think that pretty much sums us up for today. But I wanted to say to you guys, obviously, do remember that we've got episodes coming out every Sunday.
Make sure you subscribe, drop us a rating if you've enjoyed this episode. Please, please, please do make sure you pop your feelings down on our review or just click the ratings button because it really helps other people to find us and feel free to share away as well. You can of course follow us over on Instagram and on TikTok. I always make sure that our, what are called the tag things.
thing is in the description for the episode so feel free to go on there and grab our signs and go find us and tell us what you think tell us like what it's made you think about because we'd love to hear from more of our listeners but we're really really excited that you guys are here and you're listening to us and and yeah we'll be back again next week right guys I hope you have a good one
Ashley Vanerio (40:49.57)
Yeah.
Ashley Vanerio (41:02.338)
Can't wait.
Ashley Vanerio (41:05.89)
Bye.
